Your Opinion Is Needed To Help Shape The Future Of The Colony

[AgentPete]

This is the promised sticky thread asking for your thoughts, suggestions and criticisms (yes, really!) about the look and feel of the Colony and what you’d like to see improved.

I’ll be paying close attention to the thread and will try wherever feasible to implement every reasonable suggestion.

For example, one suggestion that’s already been made concerns the availability of a dark theme for the Colony. While some browsers (e.g. Firefox) will allow you to select a dark theme on any website you visit, others don’t. Websites with dark themes are easier on your eyes… and you’ll be seeing that option available in the Colony soon.

Another issue raised by a number of members is the difficulty of easily finding the forum you're looking for on our home page. As the Colony has grown, new areas have emerged like some torrid tsunamigenetic manifestation (apologies, I just wanted to use that word once). If you have thoughts about the orderly restructuring of our all-important home page, please do let’s have them.

I’ll keep this thread open for the next ten days or two weeks, so please pitch in straight away!

 

[Hannah F]

I think SIGs was a good idea, but the number of SIGs cropping up really clutters the home page.

Maybe headings could be more clarifying. I can see people getting confused between Writers' Workshops and Writers' Room. Or Writers' Room and Cafe Life. Indeed, looking at the content of the latter two, I'm hard-pushed to know the difference myself.

 

[ChandlerJules]

Hello—For Accessibility My experience is this for PopUps: I access YouTube on my big screen TV, open Genius chat and voting on my iPad. I would like to see the pages (750 words) submitted on full screen for the entire reading. For ease of viewing (now the submitted pages get minimized and show voting grid, etc.) Even with my prescription lenses that minimized page is difficult to read. It’s true I can view on iPad, but that feels even smaller. The pages are difficult to read when shrunk down. Thoughts to ponder…I value the process of viewing and analyzing the submissions. Thanks for a terrific website and experience. Cheers

 

[Jan L]

I would put everything that's older than 3 months into a LITOPIA ARCHIVES section. Then divide the homepage into CRAFT (with all threads related to the craft of writing) at the top and SOCIAL (for everything else) in the section below it. Hot topics could be featured along the side to highlight not only the latest posts but threads that members are engaging with.

 

[James Charles]

I don't see much difference between the Home page and Forums. I agree with Hannah as there seems to be not much difference between Writers Room, Writers Workshop and cafe lite. Have old threads archived and locked as it gets too busy after awhile.

 

[RK Wallis]

I would put everything that's older than 3 months into a LITOPIA ARCHIVES section

This is a great idea.

Have old threads archived and locked as it gets too busy after awhile

Equally, this.

Too often, new members (understandably eager to participate) don't notice the dates and comment on old threads.

 

[Peyton Stafford]

This is a great idea.



Equally, this.

Too often, new members (understandably eager to participate) don't notice the dates and comment on old threads.

Yes! I did that, too. Tried to add my writerly wisdom to threads long completed.

 

[Peyton Stafford]

After I figured out NOT to reply to ancient threads, I found my way. I set my preferences and made peace with Litopia. My preferences going forward:

1. Separate beta reads and requests for crits from everything else. Make this the focus. I did not join to improve my gardening skills or share favorite TV shows. No one did.
2. Focused groups, such as SIGS, should be in their own category. Not writing.
3. Commentary on the world, insights into writerly life, etc. File away for those interested in such. May be relevant. But ...

 

[Hannah F]

Info on self-publishing gets dotted between different threads. For those pursuing that direction and the self-publishers willing to give advice, it would be useful if there was a separate, dedicated forum.

 

[Hannah F]

Somewhere in Cafe Life is a great thread for book recommendations. It can be hard to find if it hasn't been used for a while. Maybe have its own forum? (Though I know we're trying to de-clutter the page).

 

[E G Logan]

Please can we keep the Back Room? And maybe make it clearer what it's for. (I know it does say, right now, but people have been known to misunderstand.)

We need somewhere that is not public, even if it doesn't get used much.

 

[Terry Lowell]

It would be great to have somewhere members could post their writing successes so we can all celebrate and be inspired by each other. Maybe a Hot News section. And if this already exists it needs to be more prominent.

 

[Brooke]

i agree that we should consider combining the writer's workshop and the writing room. but i'm still pretty new, so aside from pining for a dark mode, i think i'll leave these decisions to you guys.

 

[Brooke]

oh, also-- anyone else notice the "cool" reaction is messed up? it's way too zoomed in for most if not all times it shows up.

 

[Rachael Burnett]

I'd like to see a place where members can celebrate their achievements. I don't mean the Marketplace (where published/self-published work is available to buy), but where work (short stories, flash fiction, poetry, etc.) is published in online literary magazines and journals, etc. and is available for members to read for free. I think having this in one set place would make it easier to read other members' amazing work. It may also assist in looking for beta readers in terms of writing in a similar genre. Also, if I enjoyed the writing I could leave a comment or a Like and support the writer and which might in some small way help them get noticed or assist in their getting interest from a publisher or an agent or another piece being published.

Is it also possible to show the website, blogs, podcasts, etc for members (if they chose to show this) when you click on their profile (perhaps you can now, but I can't see any)? The benefit of this would be that other members can look at the work and services etc. of members for the purposes of potentially collaborating, sharing information and helping each other in terms of information about writing and publishing. For someone like me with anxiety, it makes it easier than asking the person directly. For example, I'd like to listen to the podcast of Annie Summer Lee and Bev, but I don't know where to find it other than the first couple they posted. There might be other blogs or podcasts, etc. of members that I might like to listen to, but I wouldn't have a clue where to find this. Or, for example, if someone has critiqued my work or I loved a shared piece from a member and I want to look at their other work, rather than trudging through Google (or asking them directly) I could click on their profile and see their website/blog/podcast, etc. and take a look.

One thing that makes me a little sad is when you make a comment, respond to a request for a critique and the person does not respond at all. I tend to delete the comment or critique thinking what I've offered (often taking a long while on a critique) is not appreciated. Perhaps, some kind of guidance on replying to people might be useful, even if it's a Like or Thumbs Up (or down) or an automatic reminder to the person to respond. I understand this might not be feasible, but perhaps adding it to the guidelines might help a bit.

 

[Brooke]

I'd like to see a place where members can celebrate their achievements. I don't mean the Marketplace (where published/self-published work is available to buy), but where work (short stories, flash fiction, poetry, etc.) is published in online literary magazines and journals, etc. and is available for members to read for free. I think having this in one set place would make it easier to read other members' amazing work. It may also assist in looking for beta readers in terms of writing in a similar genre. Also, if I enjoyed the writing I could leave a comment or a Like and support the writer and which might in some small way help them get noticed or assist in their getting interest from a publisher or an agent or another piece being published.

Is it also possible to show the website, blogs, podcasts, etc for members (if they chose to show this) when you click on their profile (perhaps you can now, but I can't see any)? The benefit of this would be that other members can look at the work and services etc. of members for the purposes of potentially collaborating, sharing information and helping each other in terms of information about writing and publishing. For someone like me with anxiety, it makes it easier than asking the person directly. For example, I'd like to listen to the podcast of Annie Summer Lee and Bev, but I don't know where to find it other than the first couple they posted. There might be other blogs or podcasts, etc. of members that I might like to listen to, but I wouldn't have a clue where to find this. Or, for example, if someone has critiqued my work or I loved a shared piece from a member and I want to look at their other work, rather than trudging through Google (or asking them directly) I could click on their profile and see their website/blog/podcast, etc. and take a look.

One thing that makes me a little sad is when you make a comment, respond to a request for a critique and the person does not respond at all. I tend to delete the comment or critique thinking what I've offered (often taking a long while on a critique) is not appreciated. Perhaps, some kind of guidance on replying to people might be useful, even if it's a Like or Thumbs Up (or down) or an automatic reminder to the person to respond. I understand this might not be feasible, but perhaps adding it to the guidelines might help a bit.

^^^ agreeing with everything here, especially the achievement-celebration space! that would be a big general mood boost for the whole site

 

[Rachael Burnett]

It would be great to have somewhere members could post their writing successes so we can all celebrate and be inspired by each other. Maybe a Hot News section. And if this already exists it needs to be more prominent.

Sorry, Terry. I just mentioned a similar thing and didn't see you'd already suggested this.

 

[mickleinapickle]

I haven't been here too long and I don't feel able to make too many suggestions, but here's my two penny's worth...

I find the site rather overwhelming. There are maybe too many forum headings. I often find something of interest on a visit, but a couple of day's later, I can't find the thread again. I actually saw this particular thread yesterday... it's taken me 10 minutes to find it again this evening. Do you need to combine a few forum headings... slim it all down a little?

Also, I find the severe restriction on the number of characters in a profile update to be too limiting. Profile updates are a good way (for me) to have a quick burst of creativity. Would it be possible to allow maybe a thousand characters... or a little bit more (as an old song once went)?

Please note that none of these comments are criticisms of the site. Merely my thoughts/observations. I'm enjoying being here and hoping to increase my participation as life's wondrous endeavours unfold. The monthly flash fiction thingamybob is bloomin' fantastic!

 

[Peyton Stafford]

Info on self-publishing gets dotted between different threads. For those pursuing that direction and the self-publishers willing to give advice, it would be useful if there was a separate, dedicated forum.

I started a SIG for it.

Self-Publishing Support Group

For writers considering the indie route...

colony.litopia.com

 

[Hannah F]

I started a SIG for it.

Self-Publishing Support Group

For writers considering the indie route...

colony.litopia.com

And that underlines the problem with having a long list of SIGs: I never noticed it (though I'm not the target audience but one day may be).

 

[Nikky Lee]

Info on self-publishing gets dotted between different threads. For those pursuing that direction and the self-publishers willing to give advice, it would be useful if there was a separate, dedicated forum.

Second this. Or potentially an area for the business and marketing side of authoring, because even if you're trad published these days, you're still expected to a lot of marketing and self promotion.

As part of that, potentially include a resources area in the mix? I often find and attend online conferences, webinars, free courses and the like that I feel members would either benefit from or be interested in. Perhaps pin the Litopia seminars at the top fo the area then let members share their finds underneath? You'd probably need some sort of tagging system to help people find the resources they want/need as well as an archiving system for events once they've passed.

 

[LA Thomas]

This is the promised sticky thread asking for your thoughts, suggestions and criticisms (yes, really!) about the look and feel of the Colony and what you’d like to see improved.

I’ll be paying close attention to the thread and will try wherever feasible to implement every reasonable suggestion.

For example, one suggestion that’s already been made concerns the availability of a dark theme for the Colony. While some browsers (e.g. Firefox) will allow you to select a dark theme on any website you visit, others don’t. Websites with dark themes are easier on your eyes… and you’ll be seeing that option available in the Colony soon.

Another issue raised by a number of members is the difficulty of easily finding the forum you're looking for on our home page. As the Colony has grown, new areas have emerged like some torrid tsunamigenetic manifestation (apologies, I just wanted to use that word once). If you have thoughts about the orderly restructuring of our all-important home page, please do let’s have them.

I’ll keep this thread open for the next ten days or two weeks, so please pitch in straight away!

I’m having to rush this as about to go on holiday so apologies if it’s a bit blunt As I don’t want to miss the opportunity before the deadline!

1. The website is outdated.

2. Pete once showed concerned about dwindling member numbers. Someone has taken the time to get over 40,000 followers on Twitter and you don’t use it.

You don’t interact with your followers, even if they tag you in posts.

You ask your ‘contestants’ for their social details but then don’t even tag them in your Twitter posts when they are in that weeks show.

Your mantra is never more than one or two tweets a week but Twitter is all about interaction.

Several times I’ve tagged and shared details of Litopia and tried to get some interaction but there is never a response.

3. I love the idea of Huddles and would love to attend more often but 5pm on Saturday is too inconvenient for me. I’ve almost always got plans on a Saturday night. however I completely understand how busy Pete must be and you can’t please everyone, all the time.

4. I have no idea how the points systems works Or if it’s something that’s out of date and doesn’t get used any more.

5. I get confused by all the different sub categories in the forums and it always takes me a while to find the one/s I want.

6. I’ve been participating in Pop Ups almost every week for several months and kinda feel it’s not appreciated, although I’m not sure what it is I’m looking for. Just the odd thanks would be nice. If you are going to introduce/update the points system it would be great if this counted for something

Having said all of that I have got lot from this forum. most of the members are friendly and have been so helpful to me!

Thanks a lot.

Keep up the good work

 

[Barbara]

There's a "side" conversation going on in Jake's self publishing thread. About The Workshops and giving critique. Basically,

There's often an imbalance with 'giving and taking' feedback and sometimes we don't even get a thank you for our hard work. Personally this has stopped me participating in there.

Maybe, we could have a setting under our avatars stating whether or not we're open to giving feedback. Having said that, that wouldn't sort the imbalance and the imbalance will simply continue.

I've mentioned this before a while ago: newbies (and oldbies) can simply put their work up, get crit, then run.

So I'm wondering if somehow members have to earn a crit via (and bear with me here) a "currency system". When we participate / join somebody's workshop, we get a virtual credit for the first crit (of 100 words) we post in there. Only the first. A credit for participating. When we want crit, we have to pay with that credit before we are able to post the work up. Limit the type of work (synopsis only, blurb only etc) to 1 per workshop. If we then want more credits to put up more work, we have to participate in more workshops. Crit for cred.

I know the world shouldn't be like that. It's a shame that it is. There are takers. But there are so many lovley helpful folk on here. Their goodwill and giving nature shouldn't be (ab)used as a free editing service.

Obvs, all our lives are busy and we don't always have time to help others by giving crit and some folk are perma busy, which is understamdable. But ... a credit system would sort it.

If we don't give we can't expect to get.

 

[Mel L]

I also don't have a lot of time this week as we are in the midst of moving but I don't want to miss the chance to chime in. Agree with so much of what's been said here by others already, especially @Peyton Stafford and @LA Thomas.

One thing I find frustrating is the Members' section. Would love to be able to browse through to find people's profiles as it's not always easy to remember their Litopia names and the icons make it easier. It is helpful to see who the staff members are, but why can't we see the 'guardians'? TBH, I don't really care about things like 'Most resources' or 'Highest reaction score' etc, so perhaps we could lose those categories.

 

[E G Logan]

Maybe, we could have a setting under our avatars stating whether or not we're open to giving feedback.

I second that. For mine, I'd like to specify that I would rather not critique work in genres I know nothing about.

 

[Pamela Jo]

I love the idea of Mastodon as an alternative to Twitter but it goes nowhere now. Maybe it needs to be the Cafe Lite section for sharing those social moments. If there is some kind of Mastodon account page for "special projects" that could be the creative outlet that Mickle Pickle pines for. I saw it mentioned on there once, but never found it.

The SIG's need more focus or oomph or something. Maybe they belong on Mastodon as well? Am I really the only one who storyboards and collects ideas for stories? That what "Stranger'er Things " is for. I would love to see what others story board.

And I still want a weekly zoom meeting to tell ghost stories, or just strange news or history items. Like the research vessel sent to investigate Japan's Bermuda Triangle disappeared. And there's strong evidence that Vincent Van Gogh was shot by a 16yr old rich kid who liked to dress as Buffalo Bill Cody.

 

[Rachael Burnett]

I second @NickyLee about a resources section and that it be divided by area. For example:

• Agent Pete's Seminars
• Writing/craft
• Blurbs/query letters/synopsis
• Marketing
• Self-publishing
• Events (which once the date has passed could be deleted or archived)

 

[RK Wallis]

Am I really the only one who storyboards and collects ideas for stories

I use Pinterest.

Totally agree with @Barbara and @E G Logan re: critiquing. People need to earn the right to have their own work critiqued. This would weed out the takers and the faint-hearted. And it can only boost a writer's WIP if critiquers enjoy critiquing that genre. In fact, you should only earn points in genres you enjoy critiquing (otherwise we might have critiquers who critique for the sake of earning points, and treat critiquing like a chore, doing the writer a disservice). Does that make sense?

 

[Peyton Stafford]

There's a "side" conversation going on in Jake's self publishing thread. About The Workshops and giving critique. Basically,

There's often an imbalance with 'giving and taking' feedback and sometimes we don't even get a thank you for our hard work. Personally this has stopped me participating in there.

Maybe, we could have a setting under our avatars stating whether or not we're open to giving feedback. Having said that, that wouldn't sort the imbalance and the imbalance will simply continue.

I've mentioned this before a while ago: newbies (and oldbies) can simply put their work up, get crit, then run.

So I'm wondering if somehow members have to earn a crit via (and bear with me here) a "currency system". When we participate / join somebody's workshop, we get a virtual credit for the first crit (of 100 words) we post in there. Only the first. A credit for participating. When we want crit, we have to pay with that credit before we are able to post the work up. Limit the type of work (synopsis only, blurb only etc) to 1 per workshop. If we then want more credits to put up more work, we have to participate in more workshops. Crit for cred.

I know the world shouldn't be like that. It's a shame that it is. There are takers. But there are so many lovley helpful folk on here. Their goodwill and giving nature shouldn't be (ab)used as a free editing service.

Obvs, all our lives are busy and we don't always have time to help others by giving crit and some folk are perma busy, which is understamdable. But ... a credit system would sort it.

If we don't give we can't expect to get.

I agree about the imbalance. I think we already have the remedy: our ability to learn from experience. If someone requests crits but never gives them, we can ignore those requests, unless we are so taken with a story that we want to contribute without expectation of reciprocity. One of the best novels I read on Litopia was by someone who ghosted after I critiqued her book and provided a lot of editorial advice. I do not hold this against her. I wish her the best and hope to see her name in an awards list.

Before joining Litopia, I tried other online writers' groups. Litopia was my last resort because it involved swapping Word files, which are notorious for spreading viruses. Several groups required members to contribute a fixed number of crits before submitting work, with a required word count for each crit. If a crit did not meet the count, it did not count. Ask yourself, if a writer submits a first draft of a 500 word story, do you want to write a 500 word crit to score a point toward submitting your own third or fourth draft novel? And do you want someone whose writing amounts to 500 word stories in first draft critiquing your novel?

About limiting crits to genres, one group did that. The problem was writers often mis-categorized their stories. I see this on Litopia, too. It's hard to keep perspective. Is your book a paranormal romance, or a contemporary paranormal with romance, intrigue, and adventure? Maybe it is a cozy romance with paranormal elements and adventure. Maybe it's high fantasy with romance... This can go on and on.

One strength of Litopia is @AgentPete's idea of critiquing according to one's immediate reactions as one reads. He explains this in the introductory emails. That's what readers do. They read. As long as the story holds them, they continue. They do not grade on point systems or genre tropes. They read with their hearts. EM Forster said the same.

Let's stay with the present system. Anyone can submit work for critique. Anyone who wants can respond. If someone writes trash, ignore them. But let's not make a rigid rule to stand between our hearts and submissions, ours and others.

 

[Barbara]

I agree about the imbalance. I think we already have the remedy: our ability to learn from experience. If someone requests crits but never gives them, we can ignore those requests, unless we are so taken with a story that we want to contribute without expectation of reciprocity. One of the best novels I read on Litopia was by someone who ghosted after I critiqued her book and provided a lot of editorial advice. I do not hold this against her. I wish her the best and hope to see her name in an awards list.

Before joining Litopia, I tried other online writers' groups. Litopia was my last resort because it involved swapping Word files, which are notorious for spreading viruses. Several groups required members to contribute a fixed number of crits before submitting work, with a required word count for each crit. If a crit did not meet the count, it did not count. Ask yourself, if a writer submits a first draft of a 500 word story, do you want to write a 500 word crit to score a point toward submitting your own third or fourth draft novel? And do you want someone whose writing amounts to 500 word stories in first draft critiquing your novel?

About limiting crits to genres, one group did that. The problem was writers often mis-categorized their stories. I see this on Litopia, too. It's hard to keep perspective. Is your book a paranormal romance, or a contemporary paranormal with romance, intrigue, and adventure? Maybe it is a cozy romance with paranormal elements and adventure. Maybe it's high fantasy with romance... This can go on and on.

One strength of Litopia is @AgentPete's idea of critiquing according to one's immediate reactions as one reads. He explains this in the introductory emails. That's what readers do. They read. As long as the story holds them, they continue. They do not grade on point systems or genre tropes. They read with their hearts. EM Forster said the same.

Let's stay with the present system. Anyone can submit work for critique. Anyone who wants can respond. If someone writes trash, ignore them. But let's not make a rigid rule to stand between our hearts and submissions, ours and others.

Yes, we do learn from experience and can chose. The Litopia way of critiquing is the best.

My thinking is more about how the actual Workshops are being used by new folk, and about the community spirit of the colony.

Litopia is about community, about support, friendships etc. The Workshops are a draw for new people. It could be used to encourage the right kind of members.

As it is, someone new can simply get feedback not to be seen again, which isn't in the spirit of the site where members are here for each other. I've spent much time helping newbies who were never seen again. I like helping and supporting people, but equally I don't want to be taken advantage of, nor waste my time and energy, because I don't have much of it. I now don't help new folk until they've been here a while (and that in itself isn't the idea of the colony either.). So, 'filtering out' the takers would be good because it would encourage the members to participate and be the kind of members that fit this group. But yes, we can simply chose to not help.

We did at one point have a sort of 'credit system' were new people couldn't put their work up in the workshops until they had participated with a certain number of posts. That prompted a certain level of commitment and set a precedence to being part of the fab and friendly community which this place is. I think they now have to wait a few days before they can post, but that doesn't encourage participation. They'll simply wait.