Dates In Stories

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Paul Whybrow

Full Member
Jun 20, 2015
Cornwall, UK
Any story is instantly dated, by the time that it takes to proceed from being edited by the author, to going through queries with literary agents, then, if successful, more editing at a publisher. By the time marketing has been decided, a book cover designed and a launch date chosen, it could be up to a couple of years after typing The End that the book hits the shelves.

The process is quicker if self-publishing, but if the plot is set in contemporary times, then events could still overtake the writing. It's easy to modify the manuscript of an eBook, but doing so might lead you towards looking like a smart arse!

The first case in My Cornish Detective series is set in 2012, so Book 1 would be nine years in the past, should I be successful with querying this spring in securing a publishing deal. I usually try to avoid political references but had to mention Brexit, as Book 3 happens in 2016 when the referendum took place. The poverty of moorland farmers drove the crimes of murder and livestock rustling.

It doesn't bother me too much, that the first story is dated, for not a lot has changed with policing since 2012, and anyway I wanted to show my protagonist's story arc from being recently widowed, though depression and on to rebuilding his life and falling in love again.

In a way, the era of any story is irrelevant, provided the narrative is strong enough. I read several hardboiled detective novels last year, set in WW2, which was barely alluded to, other than how key witnesses were fighting overseas.

Developments in technology obviously affect storytelling. I well understand why crime writers choose to set their tales before the 1990s, when computers, CCTV and smartphones became popular. Researching Big Brother and IT takes much of my time, which was why I set one novel on Bodmin Moor, to get away from surveillance and to have more face-to-face questioning of witnesses and suspects.

Not that penning Historical Fiction is easy. I've written two novellas set in the post-American Civil War era known as The Reconstruction, which required more research than any of my novels. It's not just the historical facts I had to get right, but also the overall feel of the times, the social mores, prejudices and loyalties to make things feel authentic.

Although it requires complex world-building, writing Science Fiction and Fantasy starts to look attractive! But, I'm not sure I could keep a grip on an invented world, and with the one sci-fi story I wrote, set on Mars, new discoveries by the Exploration Rovers immediately made my tale obsolete. I wonder if the popularity of dystopian stories is rooted in not having to worry about dates, for everything is torn down with people forced to begin again.

No one wants to write fiction that quickly becomes dated, and one way to avoid doing so is to limit the use of transient slang and jargon. The same thing applies to references to modern culture, for what's popular on television or on the internet now will swiftly fade from people's memories—indeed, readers might wonder why your characters aren't glued to the latest idiotic reality show.

Certainly, context is crucial. If your protagonist is gullible and hooked on trashy television, mention it, but keep things generalised rather than naming specific shows. The same thing goes for identifying brands of food and drink, where the label might confer status in the here and now, but be irrelevant in ten years.

Some cultural references should be retained, to give a sense of time, but the strength of your story should come from characterisation rather than delineating your protagonist by their shopping lists.

Using dates in stories is one of the many dilemmas an author faces, but we'll always be around. Going back to the Stone Age, people told stories, trying to make sense of the world around them as well as to entertain; nothing much has changed. As Ursula K. Le Guin observed:

There have been societies that did not use the wheel, but there have been no societies that did not tell stories.

How does mentioning dates affect your writing?

img_6250.jpg
 
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Any story is instantly dated, by the time that it takes to proceed from being edited by the author, to going through queries with literary agents, then, if successful, more editing at a publisher. By the time marketing has been decided, a book cover designed and a launch date chosen, it could be up to a couple of years after typing The End that the book hits the shelves.

The process is quicker if self-publishing, but if the plot is set in contemporary times, then events could still overtake the writing. It's easy to modify the manuscript of an eBook, but doing so might lead you towards looking like a smart arse!

The first case in My Cornish Detective series is set in 2012, so Book 1 would be nine years in the past, should I be successful with querying this spring in securing a publishing deal. I usually try to avoid political references but had to mention Brexit, as Book 3 happens in 2016 when the referendum took place. The poverty of moorland farmers drove the crimes of murder and livestock rustling.

It doesn't bother me too much, that the first story is dated, for not a lot has changed with policing since 2012, and anyway I wanted to show my protagonist's story arc from being recently widowed, though depression and on to rebuilding his life and falling in love again.

In a way, the era of any story is irrelevant, provided the narrative is strong enough. I read several hardboiled detective novels last year, set in WW2, which was barely alluded to, other than how key witnesses were fighting overseas.

Developments in technology obviously affect storytelling. I well understand why crime writers choose to set their tales before the 1990s, when computers, CCTV and smartphones became popular. Researching Big Brother and IT takes much of my time, which was why I set one novel on Bodmin Moor, to get away from surveillance and to have more face-to-face questioning of witnesses and suspects.

Not that penning Historical Fiction is easy. I've written two novellas set in the post-American Civil War era known as The Reconstruction, which required more research than any of my novels. It's not just the historical facts I had to get right, but also the overall feel of the times, the social mores, prejudices and loyalties to make things feel authentic.

Although it requires complex world-building, writing Science Fiction and Fantasy starts to look attractive! But, I'm not sure I could keep a grip on an invented world, and with the one sci-fi story I wrote, set on Mars, new discoveries by the Exploration Rovers immediately made my tale obsolete. I wonder if the popularity of dystopian stories is rooted in not having to worry about dates, for everything is torn down with people forced to begin again.

No one wants to write fiction that quickly becomes dated, and one way to avoid doing so is to limit the use of transient slang and jargon. The same thing applies to references to modern culture, for what's popular on television or on the internet now will swiftly fade from people's memories—indeed, readers might wonder why your characters aren't glued to the latest idiotic reality show.

Certainly, context is crucial. If your protagonist is gullible and hooked on trashy television, mention it, but keep things generalised rather than naming specific shows. The same thing goes for identifying brands of food and drink, where the label might confer status in the here and now, but be irrelevant in ten years.

Some cultural references should be retained, to give a sense of time, but the strength of your story should come from characterisation rather than delineating your protagonist by their shopping lists.

Using dates in stories is one of the many dilemmas an author faces, but we'll always be around. Going back to the Stone Age, people told stories, trying to make sense of the world around them as well as to entertain; nothing much has changed. As Ursula K. Le Guin observed:

There have been societies that did not use the wheel, but there have been no societies that did not tell stories.

How does mentioning dates affect your writing?

img_6250.jpg
You've convinced me Paul, I'm not going to put a single date in my contemporary novel, thus it will remain for a long time in the "present".
 
I write low fantasy, but sometimes, I would catch myself using language that was too relevant to my time. I left a couple of slip ups in, because, at some point, shouldn't there be collision with some colloquial language? Most of it was cut, because it didn't make sense for the characters - it was, after all, the author coming through, which dated the material. So like you advise, I opted to cut it or change it.

But in the end, this is my world, so anything can go, as long as I can make you believe. +1 for fantasy

Awesome observations.
 
I've tried to keep dated stuff out of my middle grade novels, but in the current one, I've slipped our current Prime Minister in--I couldn't not do it, as she was the perfect role model for the MC, and she is already one for the history books--36 years old, unmarried, gives birth in her first year in office, her partner is a stay-at-home dad--she'll be inspiring girls for decades. :)
 
I don't put dates in my novels, I don't want to nail them to a specific time, even though I'm sure the language and use of text messages etc will date the manuscript one way or t'other.

And talking of dates... I said to myself yesterday, I'd love some delicious dates (of the edible kind, but, y'know, I'm not fussy) and within five hours I was gifted a lb of khall dates all the way from Oman (very delicious indeed) and another friend gave me 2 lbs of medjool dates. Yum!! So... I thought I would diversify your topic of date-i-ness with some Date Eye Candy:
 

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Ooo! I love dates! No. Not the numerical kind, nor the socially awkward gee-do-I-really-have-to-sit-through-the-whole-movie-beside-this-guy-or-can-I-pretend-to-use-the-loo-and-duck-out kind.
 
Any story is instantly dated, by the time that it takes to proceed from being edited by the author, to going through queries with literary agents, then, if successful, more editing at a publisher. By the time marketing has been decided, a book cover designed and a launch date chosen, it could be up to a couple of years after typing The End that the book hits the shelves.

The process is quicker if self-publishing, but if the plot is set in contemporary times, then events could still overtake the writing. It's easy to modify the manuscript of an eBook, but doing so might lead you towards looking like a smart arse!

The first case in My Cornish Detective series is set in 2012, so Book 1 would be nine years in the past, should I be successful with querying this spring in securing a publishing deal. I usually try to avoid political references but had to mention Brexit, as Book 3 happens in 2016 when the referendum took place. The poverty of moorland farmers drove the crimes of murder and livestock rustling.

It doesn't bother me too much, that the first story is dated, for not a lot has changed with policing since 2012, and anyway I wanted to show my protagonist's story arc from being recently widowed, though depression and on to rebuilding his life and falling in love again.

In a way, the era of any story is irrelevant, provided the narrative is strong enough. I read several hardboiled detective novels last year, set in WW2, which was barely alluded to, other than how key witnesses were fighting overseas.

Developments in technology obviously affect storytelling. I well understand why crime writers choose to set their tales before the 1990s, when computers, CCTV and smartphones became popular. Researching Big Brother and IT takes much of my time, which was why I set one novel on Bodmin Moor, to get away from surveillance and to have more face-to-face questioning of witnesses and suspects.

Not that penning Historical Fiction is easy. I've written two novellas set in the post-American Civil War era known as The Reconstruction, which required more research than any of my novels. It's not just the historical facts I had to get right, but also the overall feel of the times, the social mores, prejudices and loyalties to make things feel authentic.

Although it requires complex world-building, writing Science Fiction and Fantasy starts to look attractive! But, I'm not sure I could keep a grip on an invented world, and with the one sci-fi story I wrote, set on Mars, new discoveries by the Exploration Rovers immediately made my tale obsolete. I wonder if the popularity of dystopian stories is rooted in not having to worry about dates, for everything is torn down with people forced to begin again.

No one wants to write fiction that quickly becomes dated, and one way to avoid doing so is to limit the use of transient slang and jargon. The same thing applies to references to modern culture, for what's popular on television or on the internet now will swiftly fade from people's memories—indeed, readers might wonder why your characters aren't glued to the latest idiotic reality show.

Certainly, context is crucial. If your protagonist is gullible and hooked on trashy television, mention it, but keep things generalised rather than naming specific shows. The same thing goes for identifying brands of food and drink, where the label might confer status in the here and now, but be irrelevant in ten years.

Some cultural references should be retained, to give a sense of time, but the strength of your story should come from characterisation rather than delineating your protagonist by their shopping lists.

Using dates in stories is one of the many dilemmas an author faces, but we'll always be around. Going back to the Stone Age, people told stories, trying to make sense of the world around them as well as to entertain; nothing much has changed. As Ursula K. Le Guin observed:

There have been societies that did not use the wheel, but there have been no societies that did not tell stories.

How does mentioning dates affect your writing?

img_6250.jpg
Hello,

I found this thread interesting because I am working on a contemporary novel and realize that references to technology and pop culture (which are key to the story) will make it outdated even as I continue to write it, and that publication, should I be that fortunate, will take even longer. Also, some specific dates affect my main character's back story so if I set the novel in the ever advancing present, then the character will keep getting older. My solution is to anchor the novel in the year 2018, but avoid references to current events (Trump, Brexit etc) that play no part in the story. I'm not sure if I should explicitly mention the year, or just let the reader assume an approximate date based on the context.

Rob
 
Great points. I'm writing a novel which is set slightly in the future, so I started with dates for events in the story, including an Act of Parliament, but then I took all the dates out and it reads better, I think.
 
Some dates are important to pay attention to, such as your protagonist's birthday. I forgot to give my Cornish Detective a birthday, but thankfully, though I'd set the five novels at different times of the year, I'd left a gap in early October for him to ignore the fact that he was getting older. At my best friend's suggestion, I chose October 4th, as that's her birthday—meaning, I'm less likely to forget it. ;)
 
Mentioning the current date dates it.
Mentioning historical dates, places it in time.
Making up historical dates also places it in time.
Making up future historical dates also places it in time.

I don't think this is true only for my writing.

And I have to add... not all the time.

And... sometimes you want the current date to date it. Sometimes you want the brand names and such .... sometimes what you're writing is a quintessential statement for the time... and so needs the dates. The example that immediately comes to mind is Fast Times at Ridgemont High... which is a book I read in the eighties about the eighties. There are probably others. Oh yeah... it was a movie too. Since my thirteen year old self checked it out of the library and has since returned it, I don't know if it's still selling, or if it has actual dates or brand names. But it's still being talked about.
 
Some dates are important to pay attention to, such as your protagonist's birthday. I forgot to give my Cornish Detective a birthday, but thankfully, though I'd set the five novels at different times of the year, I'd left a gap in early October for him to ignore the fact that he was getting older. At my best friend's suggestion, I chose October 4th, as that's her birthday—meaning, I'm less likely to forget it. ;)
It's also St Francis' Feast Day... huge celebrations in Assisi. Does your detective have anything else in common with St Francis? He should :D
 
I find it useful to specify the month in my writing either explicitly or by referring to seasonal events such as public holidays or the first snowfall. Here in Canada we have very distinct seasons so I consider the temperature, the hours of daylight and what people are wearing (T-shirts to Parkas). It helps set the scene and indicate the passage of time.
 
It's also St Francis' Feast Day... huge celebrations in Assisi. Does your detective have anything else in common with St Francis? He should :D

I didn't know that October 4th was Saint Francis' Feast Day. My protagonist is a farmer's son, with a love of ecology—animals, the countryside and creating a wild garden—all things Saint Francis loved. A happy coincidence. :)
 
And your protagonist would certainly know who his patron Saint is, even if he is an atheist... he cannot not know-

I've decided to give my protagonist Detective Chief Inspector Neil Kettle the middle name of Francis, which fits his love of nature. I'd been toying with Ian as a middle name, giving him the initials N.I.K.—a play on coppers nicking criminals—but it felt corny! Francis is better, though now I'm wondering about middle names for other characters. :rolleyes:
 
That's brilliant Paul- check out their birthday saint's name- There's usually more than one for each day. Ancestor's too are inspiring- they may have had an ancestor who ended up on the gallows or burned at the stake as a witch...
 
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