new chap here

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

thank you men. at ease.

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

Eerm..... I have some news but need advice ...
Last year, seems so long ago now, I sent off the requisite first 3 chapters to various publishing companies and agents. Most said "thank you but...."
One has asked for the whole manuscript.
Which is nice.
But on checking out the company further, they may be one of these organisations that charge the author for publishing. Yet they seem quite large, based central London.
Company called Olympia Publishing.
Anyone know of them ?

 

[Carol Rose]

My advice is to steer clear of them. They're a vanity press trying to disguise themselves as a legit publisher by not disclosing their vanity press status or pricing/terms:

http://www.sfwa.org/other-resources/for-authors/writer-beware/thumbs-down-publishers/ (fifth one down on the list)

http://pred-ed.com/pebo.ht

http://stuartrivers.blogspot.com/2008/07/olympia-publishers.html

http://absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?20613-Olympia-Publishers&highlight=olympia+publishing

 

[KG Christopher]

My advice is to steer clear of them. They're a vanity press trying to disguise themselves as a legit publisher by not disclosing their vanity press status or pricing/terms:

http://www.sfwa.org/other-resources/for-authors/writer-beware/thumbs-down-publishers/ (fifth one down on the list)

http://pred-ed.com/pebo.ht

http://stuartrivers.blogspot.com/2008/07/olympia-publishers.html

Absolute Write Water Cooler has a thread on them, too, but I'm having trouble getting into their site just now. If I can later I'll find the thread and update this one with that link as well.

As informative as ever, thanks.

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

I have, this morning, been doing a bit of digging myself.
There are quite a few complaints about their tactics and costs.
Lots of people have fallen into a very unpleasant trap and unable to get out.
Thanks guys.

 

[Paul Whybrow]

A great resource to check the reputations of agents and publishers, including magazines, is Preditors and Editors.

http://pred-ed.com/

It's free to use, and the administrator is friendly and approachable, getting back to you if you want to report a concern about a publishing firm.

For the company who showed interest in your manuscript, P & E says this:

Olympia Publishers: Not recommended.Vanity terms not disclosed until after submission. A vanity publisher.

Vanity publishers are to be avoided, unless all you want to do is have a physical copy of your novel in your hand—but there are much cheaper ways of doing that. I had my own dealings with a dodgy agent, a fantasist called Jane Dowary (try finding her on P & E) who claims to be a literary agent but who hasn't placed a book with any respectable publisher. She made a bloody nuisance of herself for several months emailing me, asking for exclusive worldwide rights to my novel. I ignored her, and she went away to torment someone else.

 

[Carol Rose]

I have, this morning, been doing a bit of digging myself.
There are quite a few complaints about their tactics and costs.
Lots of people have fallen into a very unpleasant trap and unable to get out.
Thanks guys.

They can't fall into the trap and not get out unless they sign a contract. As soon as they get an email or a letter asking for "contributions toward publishing costs" as Olympia likes to call it, they should toss the letter in the trash or delete the email. It's that simple. Sending these companies a manuscript or part of one does not constitute a contract with them. Once you realize they're a vanity press and you choose not to play, it's game over.

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

Exactly, Carol. Yet quite a few people have been caught in this way and signed up !!
Either they were foolish or they were fooled.

 

[Carol Rose]

Exactly, Carol. Yet quite a few people have been caught in this way and signed up !!
Either they were foolish or they were fooled.

Well they weren't fooled if they forked over cash willingly. They may not have understood why no author ever needs to do that, but no one forces someone to pay a vanity press any money.

The issue with vanity presses is that they tend to attract people who haven't researched the publishing industry and don't understand what a vanity press is. They're desperate to have a "publisher" and haven't taken the time to learn about the industry first or they'd realize they're not getting a publisher. They're paying ridiculous amounts of money for books they have to sell on their own.

Or, they believe vanity publishing is the same as self-publishing, which it's not. Vanity presses tend to charge an insane amount of money for bare bones services. Some of them charge extra for cover design and editing. Basically what you're paying for is the printing of the book, which you as the author then end up having to buy on your own, and try to sell. They usually have very little, if any, distribution, so good luck getting the word out. If no one knows your book is out there, you have very little chance of making any appreciable sales.

I'm not a fan of some of the things Amazon does, but if you're going to self-publish, they're probably your best bet simply because of their massive distribution. And the money you will pay people to edit the book and design you a cover (unless you design one yourself) is far less than most vanity presses charge for basically nothing in return. Except those pesky printed copies you now have to sell out of the trunk of your car. If you're lucky.

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

As I pointed out earlier, I like my apples from apple trees and my pears from pear trees.
In other words: I am not a publisher and know nothing of this industry.
But I do know that Literary agents do know this business far better than most, so that is the best route to take .

 

[Amber Zade]

Hi Cosmo. Enjoy!

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

Oh dear, is it that difficult ?

 

[Alistair Roberts]

Difficult, what? Researching the industry, not really. Self-publishing, not really. That said, you do need to be awake, or you'll get taken for a ride. I found a vanity publisher by mistake. I woke up as soon as they said, "we only want you to contribute $2,900".... I said, NO THANKS lol

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

Difficult to find a literary agent to take a new writer on ...because they are so exacting with the quality of the work, the story and it's saleability.
After all, a writer really only spends time creating the work. The agent invests their own funds in your work with the risk of making a profit or loss.
And that's what brought me here. As I've never written anything before, nor had I any plans to, so I have probably created total crap ( not related to that silent C music.. rap ) but how do I know ?? I need the right people to tell me what is and what isn't right with my 'nashings' (as I call it) not a few friends......just being polite.

I'd never heard of the term 'vanity publishers' until I came here, but I do understand the concept. And Alistair, you were so right to tell them to sling it, as such organisation devalue the individual and their work.

 

[Alistair Roberts]

Well it is near impossible to find an agent, the facts saying something like only 0.03% of submissions get picked up. That is a huge hurdle. But a good writer spends a LOT more time other than creating the original work. Far more time is spent editing and re-writing that work, proof reading it, adjusting, correcting and tightening up the story. Like anything worthwhile, it's a lot of hard work, but that's where the best stories come from

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

I have to get away from daily normal work.
I don't know about other writers or how they discipline themselves, but I know I can't concentrate on writing unless I'm well away from everyone. With just my iPad and a glass of whisky coke and it just all starts to flow. Must be the coke ! Or the peace and quiet. Can't imagine it's the flavouring !

 

[KG Christopher]

Well it is near impossible to find an agent, the facts saying something like only 0.03% of submissions get picked up. That is a huge hurdle. But a good writer spends a LOT more time other than creating the original work. Far more time is spent editing and re-writing that work, proof reading it, adjusting, correcting and tightening up the story. Like anything worthwhile, it's a lot of hard work, but that's where the best stories come from

That's the thing that keeps me motivated. I just want to write the best book ever, for my standards. I have thought about the submission process after that, but I see it as a next stage after I have finished my novel to my own standards. I suppose the submission process for me is the next step when I start to write book 2 and I undertake some self marketing, IE, get my website up and running, submit book 1 to agents, etc. The main thing for me, the big buz, will be finishing book1. (End of March now)

 

[Carol Rose]

Agents don't make money unless they sell your work to a publisher. They don't invest any money in your work, but they do invest their time. If they don't think they can sell it, they won't offer you representation. Makes sense because if they can't sell your work, they earn no percentage of your royalties once the work is published. That's how their income is generated - a percentage of royalties from their clients' work, once it's published and out there, selling to the reading public. The reason they don't take on everything submitted to them is because (hopefully) they have contacts in the publishing world, and they know what those editors and houses are looking for. They know what will sell in the genre you write and what will be a tougher sell, or what they won't be able to sell at all.

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

Although there seems to be so many views on the subject of submissions, everyone is pointing at the same place, just from a slightly different angle.
It's difficult. But a bit easier if the novel is honed to perfection - if anyone knows what that is !!!

 

[Carol Rose]

@Cosmo Anayiotos, all you can do is write the best story you can. There are many resources out there to consult for craft questions from grammar all the way to character development. You can also start a thread here in the Cafe and ask questions of the group about any of those things. People here are very happy to help.

 

[Lex Black]

I'm a bit late to say this, but "Welcome to the Colony!"

 

[Cosmo Anayiotos]

I'm a bit late to say this, but "Welcome to the Colony!"

Thank you Lex, this site is proving very helpful and understanding.