MAJOR UPDATES SUMMARY

[AgentPete]

Hello everyone,

It’s time to unveil a ton of major updates that are about to be unleashed here. There are indeed numerous changes – almost all positive – so please have a read of the following, and feel free to ask any questions that may arise.


SUBMISSION SURGERY

This is probably the only negative, so let’s get it out of the way, first. I’ve enjoyed doing them, and I think those members who participated got quite a lot out of them, too. However, for one reason or another, they weren’t popular. So, regrettably, they are disappearing.



A SIMPLIFIED MEMBERSHIP STRUCTURE

We have too many membership categories fighting with each other at the moment, and the benefits of each level aren’t terribly clear, especially to new members. So it’s time to radically simplify.

Henceforward, there will simply be two main categories of membership – free (“Basic”) and Patron.

Patrons will have a choice to either subscribe monthly or yearly. I hope most people will choose a yearly membership. The monthly costs is $9.95, and yearly $99. Optionally, you can top this up with a donation if you kindly want to, so these amounts are the minimums. This is a reduction of 50% on the current Patron level membership, representing very good value.

When a newcomer first joins Litopia, they will normally sign up to our Basic (free) membership. Thereafter, we strongly encourage them to move up to Patron level, because we cannot operate Litopia at a loss.

Nevertheless, Basic membership will have considerably broader access to the Colony than at the moment, including the Writing Groups. We want newcomers to be able to have the full Litopia experience and to appreciate how unique it is.

Other current membership levels, Benefactor & Ambassador, will disappear. This is what will happen to each existing category of membership:


BASIC

You will continue as a Basic (free) member. You will find that new areas of the Colony will become available to you, including the Writing Groups, without charge. However, we do expect you to value Litopia appropriately by converting your membership up to PATRON level as soon as you can through your Account Upgrade Control Panel.


BENEFACTOR

You will be converted to BASIC (free) membership. But please - become a Patron through your Account Upgrade Control Panel!


PATRON

If you are currently a Patron, you will find that your monthly or yearly subscription will fall dramatically to the new level.


LAUREATE & AMBASSADOR

(UPDATE) It appears that your membership cannot be automatically converted to PATRON level as expected, and you therefore have been converted to Basic (i.e. free) membership. It's likely that there will be an unexpired portion of your Laureate / Ambassador mrembership still applicable, so please send me a PM and I'll manually upgrade you.




*** GIFT UPGRADES ***

You can now gift another member a GIFT UPGRADE, i.e. any member who is currently on Basic (free) membership can receive a nice present from you. This might be a terrific way to say “thank you” after a useful critique or other service rendered. Purchase through your Account Upgrade Control Panel.




PRIORITY POP-UP SUBMISSIONS

I’ve hinted at this for some time, and now it’s here. The current backlog for Pop-Up Submissions is about six months, and likely to become even longer. For some, this may not matter – but for others, it may be very important to get an early “steer” on a project before spending months or even years on it. So now, members (Basic or Patron) can buy a Priority Submission, which will guarantee entry to the next available show (we schedule shows monthly, so at most, the wait might be five or six weeks, likely less). Buy it whenever you need through your Account Upgrade Control Panel, and you will have 28 days in which to actually make your submission.


More is planned, as well! But I’ll let you digest all the above for the moment…

 

[Eva Ulian]

Hello @AgentPete, I see your method of payment is through PayPal- and that I can get an account through my bank without use of credit card. So I will have to look into it. Eventually, I will become a "proper" member, now that's it's all simplified.

 

[AgentPete]

Eva, we also have another method - Stripe - that you can select at checkout. Some people really don't like PayPal, so there's a choice.

 

[Eva Ulian]

Eva, we also have another method - Stripe - that you can select at checkout. Some people really don't like PayPal, so there's a choice.

I will have to ask my bank if they support that, frankly, I've not heard of Stripe before- mind you, that's nothing, I know absolutely nothing about money..

 

[Emily]

I'm a Patron (now), so if I don't do anything, can I continue to pay what I'm paying now? I'm paying through Paypal. Or will it automatically change to the lower amount? (That is US$ rather than UK£?)

I'll weep at the loss of Submission Surgeries, along with the Cowbell...

 

[Andrew Okey]

Hello everyone,

It’s time to unveil a ton of major updates that are about to be unleashed here. There are indeed numerous changes – almost all positive – so please have a read of the following, and feel free to ask any questions that may arise.


SUBMISSION SURGERY

This is probably the only negative, so let’s get it out of the way, first. I’ve enjoyed doing them, and I think those members who participated got quite a lot out of them, too. However, for one reason or another, they weren’t popular. So, regrettably, they are disappearing.



A SIMPLIFIED MEMBERSHIP STRUCTURE

We have too many membership categories fighting with each other at the moment, and the benefits of each level aren’t terribly clear, especially to new members. So it’s time to radically simplify.

Henceforward, there will simply be two main categories of membership – free (“Basic”) and Patron.

Patrons will have a choice to either subscribe monthly or yearly. I hope most people will choose a yearly membership. The monthly costs is $9.95, and yearly $99. Optionally, you can top this up with a donation if you kindly want to, so these amounts are the minimums. This is a reduction of 50% on the current Patron level membership, representing very good value.

When a newcomer first joins Litopia, they will normally sign up to our Basic (free) membership. Thereafter, we strongly encourage them to move up to Patron level, because we cannot operate Litopia at a loss.

Nevertheless, Basic membership will have considerably broader access to the Colony than at the moment, including the Writing Groups. We want newcomers to be able to have the full Litopia experience and to appreciate how unique it is.

Other current membership levels, Benefactor & Ambassador, will disappear. This is what will happen to each existing category of membership:



BASIC

You will continue as a Basic (free) member. You will find that new areas of the Colony will become available to you, including the Writing Groups, without charge. However, we do expect you to value Litopia appropriately by converting your membership up to PATRON level as soon as you can.


BENEFACTOR

You will be converted to BASIC (free) membership. But please - become a Patron through your Account Upgrade Control Panel!


PATRON

If you are currently a Patron, you will find that your monthly or yearly subscription will fall dramatically to the new level.


AMBASSADOR

Your membership will be converted to PATRON level.




*** GIFT UPGRADES ***

You can now gift another member a GIFT UPGRADE, i.e. any member who is currently on Basic (free) membership can receive a nice present from you. This might be a terrific way to say “thank you” after a useful critique or other service rendered. Purchase through your Account Upgrade Control Panel.




PRIORITY POP-UP SUBMISSIONS

So now, members (Basic or Patron) can buy a Priority Submission, which will guarantee entry to the next available show (we schedule shows monthly, so at most, the wait might be five or six weeks, likely less). Buy it whenever you need through your Account Upgrade Control Panel, and you will have 28 days in which to actually make your submission.

Pete - would this also cover submissions we already have in the pipeline? One of mine has been in there since November last, whilst the other (April) submission of mine is quickly turning into my main WIP and I'd been to gauge reactions to it as its a risky and (arguably) stupidly ambitious project...

 

[AgentPete]

I'm a Patron (now), so if I don't do anything, can I continue to pay what I'm paying now? I'm paying through Paypal. Or will it automatically change to the lower amount? (That is US$ rather than UK£?)

I'll weep at the loss of Submission Surgeries, along with the Cowbell...

You will automatically go to the lower amount. If you then go to the Account Control Panel, you can cancel your existing Patron account and then start a new one, at whatever donation you wish. I know that's a bit clunky, but it's how computers are

 

[AgentPete]

Pete - would this also cover submissions we already have in the pipeline? One of mine has been in there since November last, whilst the other (April) submission of mine is quickly turning into my main WIP and I'd been to gauge reactions to it as its a risky and (arguably) stupidly ambitious project...

Yes, it does. But please PM me with the details, too, just in case.

 

[AgentPete]

I will have to ask my bank if they support that, frankly, I've not heard of Stripe before- mind you, that's nothing, I know absolutely nothing about money..

They are both payment processors, that's all. Both process the usual credit and debit cards.

 

[Eva Ulian]

They are both payment processors, that's all. Both process the usual credit and debit cards.

Right, I'll go and talk to the bank people about this.

 

[georginaK]

Still not clear about current submissions. I submitted mine in March I think—so will I be bumped by people who purchase a submission? If we buy a place along with loads of others will we get priority depending on when we originally submitted, or is it like starting over? Thanks

 

[Steve C]

My initial reaction to this flood of changes is 'Oh Dear'
The loss of submission surgery is a shame and wish it could have been maintained even as a separate paid for service. For me, it was something I was aiming for. I find Pop Ups interesting to watch but not something I am interested in paying for. 700 words is not enough for most authors to show their worth.
The net effect for me is that I am being asked to double the amount I was happy to pay ($5/month) as a benefactor and for no reason. I find it odd that only patrons are allowed to also be benefactors, why not allow basic members to also contribute whatever they see fit? I don't care about the title.

A note on the layout of the Account/upgrade page.
There are two identical lists of what a patron gets but no list of what a basic member gets so it is difficult to see the advantages of paying. Better to have a list of basic features alongside one list of a what a patron gets with a small note outlining the two payment options. People like to see what they are paying for clearly compared with what is available for free.

 

[RK Wallis]

for no reason

I disagree, a forum costs money to run (I know I pay the bills for the Australian Writers Forum). Without supporters, then this forum would cease to exist. That would be sad; I'd miss the interaction with other writers. I don't think, 'what's in it for me'? I think, 'what can I do to help keep this forum active?'

 

[Steve C]

I disagree, a forum costs money to run (I know I pay the bills for the Australian Writers Forum). Without supporters, then this forum would cease to exist. That would be sad; I'd miss the interaction with other writers. I don't think, 'what's in it for me'? I think, 'what can I do to help keep this forum active?'

I think you misunderstand. I was already contributing for no reason, not buying anything. I started contributing when benefactors had no more access than basic members. I was making a donation. It was an option for basic members that has been removed. With the new set up I have to either double my contribution or not donate at all without any real change to what I can access. I don't appreciate being put in that situation and would like to decide for myself how much I want to donate for free. It seems daft to insist only paying members can make donations. My suggestions are made with the interests of the forum in mind not my own.

 

[Eva Ulian]

Still not clear about current submissions. I submitted mine in March I think—so will I be bumped by people who purchase a submission? If we buy a place along with loads of others will we get priority depending on when we originally submitted, or is it like starting over? Thanks

I believe @AgentPete was considering doing Pop ups twice a week. Maybe he will keep the second one just for paying submissions and any slots over can fit in some from the normal pile, which has a six months' waiting list- amazingly popular, understandably so, where else can you get your submission evaluated like this? It certainly helped me a lot... and yes, I had to wait six months too. So hang on there Georgina, your turn will come too.

 

[Deleted member 604]

Hey Everyone,

It saddens me to hear all this and I'm not on here so much these days preparing to work my notice, move and start Uni etc. So, I feel I have neglected this place.
@AgentPete the loss of Submission Surgery is inconsolable, would you consider an alternative?

I've been thinking of this one for a while, it's called - The Fledged and basically you look at our first chapter nothing more and nothing less.
Your review would help us become full-fledged, help us gain our feathers so to speak and at the same time you could tell us straight up where it would stand in the industry and what the industry is after and pick one MAJOR WEAK POINT IN OUR WRITING TO WORK ON ETC.

As from looking and critiquing regularly in the Writing Group our first chapters is something we all struggle with, even me and then you could review it again in 3 months time and like POP-UPS why not make 'The Fledged' public and treat it as separate, a live show one evening of the week. I'll volunteer for my work to be the first to be Fledged.
Maybe do a few fledglings in one show, just a suggestion.

And use 'The Fledged Show' to advertise and encourage the Fast-Track submission which I would call The Flight.

Also, personally I feel Litopia needs to be more engaging and active in a practical writing sense. As things, have got stale for me on here being truthful. As a writer I need something to stimulate, challenge me.

@AgentPete PM me for further suggestions and a chat.

Kindest Regards,

Rainbow

 

[AgentPete]

Still not clear about current submissions. I submitted mine in March I think—so will I be bumped by people who purchase a submission? If we buy a place along with loads of others will we get priority depending on when we originally submitted, or is it like starting over? Thanks

What we’re saying for Priority Submissions is “next available show”, which depending on when the submission is actually received, could be from 10 days to about five weeks. You will be given an exact date, and you won't be bumped.

For free submissions, I don’t want the backlog to be 6 months or more, which is why I’m actively thinking about 2 shows a week. However, this is a lot more work for everyone, and we can’t get to that stage without having some funding in place.

 

[Carol Rose]

Three cheers for the simplified Membership Structure! Thank you for all you do, @AgentPete. There truly is nothing like Litopia out there for writers. I hope others realize that. So much here to take advantage of.

I'm sad that the Submission Surgery was not better utilized. I was the first one to use it, and I found it immensely helpful. Where else can you get a one-on-one for ninety minutes with an agent??? No place I know of, that's for sure.

 

[AgentPete]

My initial reaction to this flood of changes is 'Oh Dear'
The loss of submission surgery is a shame and wish it could have been maintained even as a separate paid for service. For me, it was something I was aiming for.

Yes, I enjoyed doing it, as well. And being able to take some time to look at the totality of the submission was a bonus.

I think it will return in one form or another. But we first have to get the underlying membership structure soundly, in place, before we can start building on it.

I find Pop Ups interesting to watch but not something I am interested in paying for. 700 words is not enough for most authors to show their worth.

In a commercial publishing environment, that’s the commercial reality, like it or not. You can literally spends years on a manuscript, only to have it summarily rejected (maybe by the office junior) because he/she didn’t like the title, the blurb or the first page or two. It is that aspect of the submissions process that Pop-Ups focuses on.

The net effect for me is that I am being asked to double the amount I was happy to pay ($5/month) as a benefactor and for no reason. I find it odd that only patrons are allowed to also be benefactors, why not allow basic members to also contribute whatever they see fit? I don't care about the title.

A yearly membership comes out to $8.25 a month. That isn't double. It's up to you to decide if that represents good value or not.

A note on the layout of the Account/upgrade page.
There are two identical lists of what a patron gets but no list of what a basic member gets so it is difficult to see the advantages of paying. Better to have a list of basic features alongside one list of a what a patron gets with a small note outlining the two payment options. People like to see what they are paying for clearly compared with what is available for free.

If you log out and look at that page, you'll see the "Basic" membership option.

 

[AgentPete]

Hey Everyone,

It saddens me to hear all this and I'm not on here so much these days preparing to work my notice, move and start Uni etc. So, I feel I have neglected this place.
@AgentPete the loss of Submission Surgery is inconsolable, would you consider an alternative?

Yes, but not at the moment.

As things, have got stale for me on here being truthful. As a writer I need something to stimulate, challenge me.

I thought that was one of the reasons you shouldered responsibility for the Health Club? Let me know if you don’t want to do that any more.

 

[Emily]

^^^^ @Carol Rose , absolutely.

The way I see it, we are not "paying" Peter commensurate with what acrobatics he is will to perform to keep us entertained and writing. We are paying to keep the forum, this little writerly gem on the internet alive, and free and safe. That's it. If you want to get more out of it, add more in. Anything above and beyond what is happening now takes MASSIVE amounts of time, energy and... money.

 

[AgentPete]

I'm sad that the Submission Surgery was not better utilized. I was the first one to use it, and I found it immensely helpful. Where else can you get a one-on-one for ninety minutes with an agent??? No place I know of, that's for sure.

I don’t quite understand why it wasn’t more popular, either.

 

[Barbara]

^^^^ @Carol Rose , absolutely.

The way I see it, we are not "paying" Peter commensurate with what acrobatics he is will to perform to keep us entertained and writing. We are paying to keep the forum, this little writerly gem on the internet alive, and free and safe. That's it. If you want to get more out of it, add more in. Anything above and beyond what is happening now takes MASSIVE amounts of time, energy and... money.

This.

And this:

Thank you for all you do, @AgentPete.

Re supporting Litopia: I see it as a tiny investment into massive gains in my writing career. This place has helped me so much. Long may it exist.

 

[Deleted member 604]

@AgentPete I thought that was one of the reasons you shouldered responsibility for the Health Club? Let me know if you don’t want to do that any more.


I mean as a Writer not as a Health Club Czar. It's not that I don't want to do it anymore, it is about having the time to do it. In my first year of Uni studying Psychology I will have seven assignments to do. Maybe it would be better to give it to someone who has plenty of time to give and the enthusiasm it deserves as I won't have much time to write either, sadly.

I wish I could pay all the agents I have sought representation from past and present to fast track my manuscript.

 

[Carol Rose]

^^^^ @Carol Rose , absolutely.

The way I see it, we are not "paying" Peter commensurate with what acrobatics he is will to perform to keep us entertained and writing. We are paying to keep the forum, this little writerly gem on the internet alive, and free and safe. That's it. If you want to get more out of it, add more in. Anything above and beyond what is happening now takes MASSIVE amounts of time, energy and... money.

TOTALLY agree!!

 

[AgentPete]

With the new set up I have to either double my contribution or not donate at all without any real change to what I can access. I don't appreciate being put in that situation and would like to decide for myself how much I want to donate for free. It seems daft to insist only paying members can make donations. My suggestions are made with the interests of the forum in mind not my own.

I understand what you’re saying, Steve. Unfortunately, only a minority of people felt like you, i.e. that you wanted to support Litopia via a donation of a size you would choose. That’s why we’re moving now towards a model that pretty much expects members to pay $9.95 / $8.25 yearly equivalent in return for a full membership. I think Litopia is worth that, we’ll see if others agree.

There still will be a minority of generous souls who will wish to give something extra, and the new structure allows them to do that. But we will not survive if we depend solely on donations, sad to say.

 

[Carol Rose]

DISCLAIMER: This is not directed at any one member.

What some people seem to not realize is that @AgentPete has clients. He's an actual, live literary agent. And he's busy making money for them with book deals, film deals, and distribution rights deals. THAT is his source of income, not Litopia.

He maintains this site because he's passionate about helping writers succeed.

But bandwidth costs money. None of us have free Internet. Not unless the only time we use it is on our phones via the cellular network, or if we hang out all day and night in places with free WiFi. But in your home, you're likely paying for it. I pay beaucoup dollars to Xfinity here in the USA to have fast, reliable Internet.

It's not a free service to maintain a website like this. All these forums, chat rooms, and hosting of podcasts cost MONEY. Peter's giving of his time and expertise to strangers on the Internet, but he doesn't have to do that.

During the time I was writing but not yet published, and during the time I have been published, I've met agents online and at writing conferences. And I'm here to tell you there is NOTHING like this place, and no one like @AgentPete out there.

That's why I'm here. It's why I stay. It's why I give my time and what little knowledge/experience I have to this place. Because it's given me so much. Because without it, quite literally, I would not be published.

Like Peter said up there somewhere, it's up to you as individuals to decide if the price is worth it. If it's not, no one is going to try to talk you into staying or justify why you should. You're adults. Look around out there for something comparable, and then figure it out for yourselves what Litopia has to offer. Simple, really.

 

[Eva Ulian]

I think discussions like these are truly helpful. Apart from being informative it makes us as a group realize, what a marvel it is to belong to such a unique phenomena- as @Carol Rose said, there is nothing remotely like this out there. I also see how the enthusiasm from people posting here that there is a great potential to bring to the awareness of others in the industry some of the pit-falls it falls into. But to do so Litopians must feel integral, proud of belonging to such a group and consequently make it sound. It is after all, so unique and would be unpardonable if we allow it to disintegrate.

 

[Barbara]

It's why I give my time and what little knowledge/experience I have to this place.

it's up to you as individuals to decide if the price is worth it.

I think discussions like these are truly helpful.

I find the more I put in and participate, the more I learn, and the more I get out of the site. It's great to have a place to discuss stuff with fellow authors, kick ideas about, chat about writing.

 

[RK Wallis]

I don’t quite understand why it wasn’t more popular, either.

I can only speak for myself, but my MS isn't ready yet, otherwise, I would have been interested. It normally takes a massive effort to complete a book with ten fingers, with 1-3 fingers (on non-dominant hand) it's extra slow. I think it a grand idea, but not being able to talk also kinda kills the show too, lol!