Reality Check We need to talk - and be able to talk - about ‘offence’

Andy D

Amusement In case anyone needs a laugh...

  • Andy D
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Pamela Jo

Fun with Query letters

  • Pamela Jo
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These kind of conversations that hold a lot of gravitas, always benefit from a bit of counterbalance too, though...
And considering this thread grew from a show on comedy/humour, I think it was a rather beautiful segue into the world of double entendres and ancient Irish genetalia-flashing stone carvings :)
 
Sorry off main topic. BUT.

There I am sitting just now watching the local news and up pops the thread’s OP reporting for ITV live from Wakehurst.

‘I know him. He’s in our writing group,’ I tell Mrs Jonny. :) I think she was impressed by the kind of online company I’m keeping.
 
Emily said:
I do have to disagree with your disagreement a little bit :)

I am a visual artist, and I teach art. I've students who have and will paint /create for their entire life and never sell a thing, perhaps never show another person either. But they are artists because they create art. It's irrelevant if no one pronounces them to be artists. They are still artists.

Maybe this is just me though? I don't give a continental shite what someone else pronounces me to be or not be. I'm not responsible for their feelings or opinions, only how I respond to them.
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And I would call those people not artists but creatives who are a wonderful tribe and should be recognised and valued. Creativity is what will save us in the decades to come. In fact the mess we're in, it can be argued, is from the lack of creativity in engineering and science. Artisans may be the true Artists of our time. But calling anyone creative, Artists, and anything they do Art makes it less important rather than more. Art in the end is what will survive into the future because it means something to those who see it and value it. It is transcendent. The other thing I'm arguing against is the idea that Art is anything you can get away with. Or that Artists have a free card to be rotten human beings, because ART! Gaugain was a shit. His Art doesn't really absolve him of that. I guess I saw too many rich trust fund babies in NYC and London giving their life meaning by calling themselves Artists. I think there has to be a word reserved for 'more' and 'better than' even if that puts me in a position to be called judgemental.
 
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Pamela Jo said:
And I would call those people not artists but creatives who are a wonderful tribe and should be recognised and valued. Creativity is what will save us in the decades to come. In fact the mess we're in, it can be argued, is from the lack of creativity in engineering and science. Artisans may be the true Artists of our time. But calling anyone creative, Artists, and anything they do Art makes it less important rather than more. Art in the end is what will survive into the future because it means something to those who see it and value it. It is transcendent. The other thing I'm arguing against is the idea that Art is anything you can get away with. Or that Artists have a free card to be rotten human beings, because ART! Gaugain was a shit. His Art doesn't really absolve him of that. I guess I saw too many rich trust fund babies in NYC and London giving their life meaning by calling themselves Artists. I think there has to be a word reserved for 'more' and 'better than' even if that puts me in a position to be called judgemental.
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I do understand where you are coming from, I really do :heart:
 
Emily said:
I do understand where you are coming from, I really do :heart:
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My thoughts really began with calling a standup comedian an Artist. I think that perhaps comedy can reach something akin to Art and my definition would be if that comedian can make a child in a wheelchair laugh at their own plight-then to my mind that is Art. But the reality is more like Trump making fun of the reporter with MS or another American radio shockjock who made fun of Michael J Fox when he appeared in a wheelchair jerking uncontrollably. Fascists do not seem to have other kind of humour but punching down.
 
Pamela Jo said:
My thoughts really began with calling a standup comedian an Artist. I think that perhaps comedy can reach something akin to Art and my definition would be if that comedian can make a child in a wheelchair laugh at their own plight-then to my mind that is Art. But the reality is more like Trump making fun of the reporter with MS or another American radio shockjock who made fun of Michael J Fox when he appeared in a wheelchair jerking uncontrollably. Fascists do not seem to have other kind of humour but punching down.
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I would say, in an objective sense, it is Art either way--someone made to invoke an emotional response. As Pete's mantra goes, "art is about how it makes you feel."

Having said that, I 100% agree with you on the second point about the difference between laughing with someone and laughing at someone. One is humans helping either other get through life; the other is being a f[BLEEP!]king bully.

Which would be funny if it weren't so infuriating, given your examples: these garbage humans think they are punching down when they're beneath everyone else.

Also...really, @Emily?
 
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Andy D

Amusement In case anyone needs a laugh...

  • Andy D
  • Replies: 17
Pamela Jo

Fun with Query letters

  • Pamela Jo
  • Replies: 0
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