Professional editing?

[SarahC]

Was researching agents this evening, and one of the websites mentioned a professional editing service to get your MS as polished as possible before submission.

Full disclosure - unless I find buried treasure in my garden I'm not going to be hiring a professional editor - but is this something people do? Is the expectation there to submit something professionally polished?

On a slightly separate note, I clicked on a client list for one agent and read the words "Oxford" and "Cambridge" so many times I thought I was looking at results of a recent rowing regatta.

Diversity in Publishing etc. etc.

 

[Eva Ulian]

I never take up reccomendations for editing services from an agent because I suspect they get a percentage of that. If the agent was truly interested in your book, he/she would tell you what needed editing, not send you off to pay someone else to do it.

 

[Barbara]

They sound pretentious.

On their website, did they simply say it's advisable to have it edited professionally, or did they include a link to an editorial service?

If it has a link to the editorial service, then it's a moneymaking trap. It'll be their friend. Stay clear of both.

If they say it's 'advisable' be cautious too.

The expectation of an agent is (or should be) for you to submit a professional looking work which is as good as you can make it. How you get there is up to you. Professionally polished? Sure, consider it if you find the gold, but decent agents don't expect it.

Also, keep in mind, having your submission polished to perfection (by professional editors) won't guarantee an agent will look at it in a better light than any other sub. The sub has either a story they can sell or it hasn't. The agent either has a publisher to take it to, or they don't.

From the little I've seen of your writing, you don't need a professional editor at the agent submission stage.Just self editing and Beta readers. Of course if you find that treasure and you do want an editor then get one. But choose her/him yourself and because they edit that kind of genre/ type of work, not because of an agent's recommendation.

In short, you don't need one.

 

[E G Logan]

On a slightly separate note, I clicked on a client list for one agent and read the words "Oxford" and "Cambridge" so many times I thought I was looking at results of a recent rowing regatta.

I have done a lot of academic (university) editing, but I wouldn't say it necessarily qualifies anyone to do the kind of creative editing required for a fiction ms.
(On occasions it has been very creative, but in a completely different way...)

 

[E G Logan]

because they edit that kind of genre/ type of work, not because of an agent's recommendation.

Absolutely!

 

[SarahC]

In short, you don't need one.

Just as well as I have yet to find a Bronze Age artefact in my vegetable patch. Thanks for the reassurance. I did think as much, but wanted to check in case it was one of those things everyone else is secretly doing

 

[MattScho]

One of the bits of wisdom imparted to me when I was a kid was from my mom, who often noted: "You can learn just as much at the public library as you can at Harvard. It's just that at the public library, you have to do all the work."
Decades later, during an interview there, when I repeated that tidbit to the interviewer, he clapped his hands and said, "Exactly. so true. However, I would note, we are an enormous advantage on helping you get to that place."
This is how I see professional editing. A really good editor is worth a bronze age relic. After a really good editor has been through your work, it will be more "you" than you thought possible. (flipside, a meh to crap editor isn't worth the rusting shovel you've used to dig up the relic).
But, you can get to that point of YOU without an editor. It's just on you to figure out how.
As noted above, it's quite possible the agency was running some sort of kickback scam, in which case there is nothing to do but move on. It's also quite possible the agency rejects a lot of manuscripts because they aren't professionally presented, and this annoys them, or makes them sad. In that case, they aren't looking for a stamp of approval from a professional editor, they're looking for professionalism in the work, clean and clear writing, proper presentation, etc.
Have at it!

 

[BrianY]

I say no to all pre-submission external editing. Polished is okay if you're that kind of person, but each publisher has its own and different definition of it. Knock your brains out to make sure your submission says exactly what you want it too and nothing more or less.

 

[Eva Ulian]

I've always had this feeling about editors- they can cause more harm than good. At times, if you do what they tell you they are very good at wiping the sparkle that's in your original impression.
BTW Once you get an offer- it is the publisher who will come up with an editor for you- then you can forget everything I've said about editors.
But prior to that the best editor is often yourself, listen to your guts, they have your best interests at heart.

 

[BrianY]

I've done nine trade-published books and never hired an editor. Also, every one of the editors the publishers assigned was fantastic and some are still my Facebook friends.

 

[MattScho]

I've always had this feeling about editors- they can cause more harm than good. At times, if you do what they tell you they are very good at wiping the sparkle that's in your original impression.
BTW Once you get an offer- it is the publisher who will come up with an editor for you- then you can forget everything I've said about editors.
But prior to that the best editor is often yourself, listen to your guts, they have your best interests at heart.

How can the editors who are assigned by a publisher be a good thing if editors, overall, are a negative?
I don't think you're referring to quality, in the end, but price.
IMO, working with a good editor, at any stage, is a good thing. If nothing else, it's an education.
Working with a bad editor, however, is a very bad thing, and I will agree that they cause more harm than good.
I've worked with hundreds of editors, from the very, very bad, not at all good, horrible people and worse with words variety to the transcendent, I still think about them at least once a day and always when I write and they made my writing and life better variety.
Having said that, to date, I've not spent my own money on an editor or a writing coach. Given the economics of writing fiction, I'm not sure they're a great or even a possible investment for most writers (barring those who find not priceless, but heftily priced relics in the garden).

 

[BrianY]

It could be the money. However, I spend a fortune on coffee and muffins with the intention of stimulating my writing and don't regret it. There's some psychology involved. I have spent big bucks to attend a few conferences and workshops and didn't regret that either.

I think I favor publisher's editors so strongly because they help me feel like I fit in.

 

[E G Logan]

Going back to the original question of whether to employ a professional editor ahead of submitting a manuscript –

Putting aside questions of editor suitability and price, IMHO* what this boils down to is: a professional editor may make your ms. read better.
what s/he can't do is make it sell.

*And, full disclosure, I am a professional (academic) editor.

 

[Eva Ulian]

How can the editors who are assigned by a publisher be a good thing if editors, overall, are a negative?

Ah, I love this @MattScho. First let me deal with the editor assigned by a publisher. My feeling towards that editor is complete trust and confidence in that person because I know the publisher wants my book to sell and would never assign an editor who would not try to do that and quite honestly I would do my very best to conform to the advice given me.

If however, I am at the submission stage, I would never dream of getting an editor for two basic reasons.

1. If the editor finds he/she has to make numerous changes, then what I am presenting to a prospective publisher can hardly be said to be my own work- but a work aided by someone else. To me that's cheating- I am not presenting myself in my true colours and once found out I'd be dropped like a bomb. And I will be found out, as soon as I write something else. If I have to depend heavily on someone else to make my work decent how can I possibly call myself a writer?

May I also add here that there are occasions when an editor can suggest changes (which are acted upon by the author) that the eventual publisher would not have wanted to have been made. So, on such occasions editors can jeopardize your chances of getting published.

2. If the editor doesn't need to make many changes, then that work is good to go without spending hundreds to do so.

That's why I strongly suggest @SarahC to put her trust in her own guts, have faith in herself, so that the publisher knows who in effect he/she is dealing with, a plain and simple unadulterated author who has not been "worked over" by an editor.