How Photogenic are You?

Querying across 'The Pond.'

Happy Thanksgiving to my US friends!

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Paul Whybrow

Full Member
Jun 20, 2015
Cornwall, UK
I'm still immersed in querying literary agents and am up to 60 emailed submissions. This stage is the worst part of writing for me, even worse than editing—for at least with that, I can see improvement—whereas querying is like waiting for a reply to a prayer!

It would be something if agents streamlined their submission process, agreeing on a standard format. But they won't, as there are still hundreds of individual agencies. Publishing may be dominated by the Big Five, but literary agencies, for the most part, retain their own ways of doing things.

Of the 60 submissions I've made, only 10 wanted the same package when it came to query letter, synopsis and writing sample. The rest stipulated different lengths of query, synopsis and number of chapters or words from my novel. Some want everything pasted into the body of the email, others as attachments in Word.doc. One insisted on PDF attachments.

I'm ranting to the already jaded here, but this finickiness is what disillusions authors from taking things further. I dare say, that many give up at this stage, either shoving their manuscript in a drawer or turn to self-publishing an ebook.

An increasing number of agencies are going over to an online form as a means of submission, which is more efficient and standardised in format. I prefer it, to mucking about with an email submission, laden with attachments.

Nevertheless, I was startled to see that Coombs Moylett Maclean insist on an attached jpeg image of the writer on their submission form.

About Coombs Moylett Maclean

This is a new one on me, though I dragged out an eight-year-old image of me looking like the Green Man. I've started to have suspicions that some literary agencies choose their clients by how attractive they are, as some client portfolios look like modelling agencies!

paulgreenman-paul1.jpg


They can't legally ask how old you are, though they try to get around that by asking for details of how long you've been writing.

I appreciate that a writer is as much a part of the 'brand' that their books represent and that their portrait will be used for marketing, but this development smacks of prejudice based on looks—of appearance over content.

What do you think?
 
Gosh, that's a new one on me. But never mind, publishers do use pics on many book covers and Green Man isn't a bad authorial look. I don't imagine it's cutesy they're after and many a famous writer has a pic on a book cover that is kind rather than cruel but shows a particular quality that's special to them.
 
As someone who has to put up with bad first impressions just from walking into a room - I can understand to some extent. In fact it regularly plays in my head if I'm going to be honest - it could be due to my own life time insecurities I've had to constantly battle with. So I'm unfortunately writing with this emotion still raw.

On the phone I am fine but when I meet clients I've had one literally roll their eyes when they realised they travelled over 300 miles to see me only to find I'm not what they expected to look like..I have so many anecdotal examples that shows how bias people are upon first impression. In 1987 during the famous storm my mother didn't check that school was closed so I found myself stranded 1 hour train ride away from home with no way of knowing how to get back so a kind elderly man called an officer to take me in. Inside the dark confines of Queens Park police station I sat down patiently waiting for my parents to collect me opposite a female police officer who did nothing else but stare me down in disgust at my existence.

I can't forget such an uncomfortable experience. Still to this day as an adult I experience bias and now we can see how one class of people can still get away with misogyny and racism but others can't even look a certain way without experience the negative attitude from others. In many ways I would say the western civilisation is still under developed in the area of superficial and unjustified judgements.

Maybe I should write a book on this as a cathartic exercise.
 
Lady Emerald, one look at your photo says you're eminently likeable. I hope and trust you like and love yourself as utterly as you ought. And if you do, when you do, no one can touch you. You can enrage them by not even noticing them but it's a thing that has to be learned sometimes, and the higher your own standards, the more you might struggle to forgive yourself your own mortal frailties. People are just horrible sometimes. It wears many different guises. I've encountered unfriendliness when using a wheelchair as if was some moral deficiency, not just a nuisance to others, and having experienced much kindness while dragging myself about on a stick for 20 years in perpetual pain with every step. At school I was sometimes called posh or snobby, just because I didn't have a strong regional accent, and I told them they were the snobs. And they were. Inverted snobbery. As a student I was yelled at in Leicester, going about my own business, and called a stuck up white bitch by a group of young Pakistani men the other side of the road. If I was nervous, it was because they were a big group of loud young men and I was on my own on an otherwise quiet street. People can always find SOMETHING, some reason not to like you. If they are narrow, insecure or plain mean, they'll show their own nature and do that right away. Smile and most smile with you. The others can just do one.
 
I'm still immersed in querying literary agents and am up to 60 emailed submissions. This stage is the worst part of writing for me, even worse than editing—for at least with that, I can see improvement—whereas querying is like waiting for a reply to a prayer!

It would be something if agents streamlined their submission process, agreeing on a standard format. But they won't, as there are still hundreds of individual agencies. Publishing may be dominated by the Big Five, but literary agencies, for the most part, retain their own ways of doing things.

Of the 60 submissions I've made, only 10 wanted the same package when it came to query letter, synopsis and writing sample. The rest stipulated different lengths of query, synopsis and number of chapters or words from my novel. Some want everything pasted into the body of the email, others as attachments in Word.doc. One insisted on PDF attachments.

I'm ranting to the already jaded here, but this finickiness is what disillusions authors from taking things further. I dare say, that many give up at this stage, either shoving their manuscript in a drawer or turn to self-publishing an ebook.

An increasing number of agencies are going over to an online form as a means of submission, which is more efficient and standardised in format. I prefer it, to mucking about with an email submission, laden with attachments.

Nevertheless, I was startled to see that Coombs Moylett Maclean insist on an attached jpeg image of the writer on their submission form.

About Coombs Moylett Maclean

This is a new one on me, though I dragged out an eight-year-old image of me looking like the Green Man. I've started to have suspicions that some literary agencies choose their clients by how attractive they are, as some client portfolios look like modelling agencies!

paulgreenman-paul1.jpg


They can't legally ask how old you are, though they try to get around that by asking for details of how long you've been writing.

I appreciate that a writer is as much a part of the 'brand' that their books represent and that their portrait will be used for marketing, but this development smacks of prejudice based on looks—of appearance over content.

What do you think?
Great photo. You look kind of like Zeus, having been woken from his post-prandial slumber by an insistent knocking, opening the door to find a couple of Mormons smiling at him.
 
As someone who has to put up with bad first impressions just from walking into a room - I can understand to some extent. In fact it regularly plays in my head if I'm going to be honest - it could be due to my own life time insecurities I've had to constantly battle with. So I'm unfortunately writing with this emotion still raw.

On the phone I am fine but when I meet clients I've had one literally roll their eyes when they realised they travelled over 300 miles to see me only to find I'm not what they expected to look like..I have so many anecdotal examples that shows how bias people are upon first impression. In 1987 during the famous storm my mother didn't check that school was closed so I found myself stranded 1 hour train ride away from home with no way of knowing how to get back so a kind elderly man called an officer to take me in. Inside the dark confines of Queens Park police station I sat down patiently waiting for my parents to collect me opposite a female police officer who did nothing else but stare me down in disgust at my existence.

I can't forget such an uncomfortable experience. Still to this day as an adult I experience bias and now we can see how one class of people can still get away with misogyny and racism but others can't even look a certain way without experience the negative attitude from others. In many ways I would say the western civilisation is still under developed in the area of superficial and unjustified judgements.

Maybe I should write a book on this as a cathartic exercise.

Ha! Well--top this- -someone once said to me--oh, from your voice I didn´t image you were Mexican. And you sounded thinner! F that! Humans tend to be idiots. I fear more so these days. Just smile, and everything will be forgotten.
 
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I'm still immersed in querying literary agents and am up to 60 emailed submissions. This stage is the worst part of writing for me, even worse than editing—for at least with that, I can see improvement—whereas querying is like waiting for a reply to a prayer!

It would be something if agents streamlined their submission process, agreeing on a standard format. But they won't, as there are still hundreds of individual agencies. Publishing may be dominated by the Big Five, but literary agencies, for the most part, retain their own ways of doing things.

Of the 60 submissions I've made, only 10 wanted the same package when it came to query letter, synopsis and writing sample. The rest stipulated different lengths of query, synopsis and number of chapters or words from my novel. Some want everything pasted into the body of the email, others as attachments in Word.doc. One insisted on PDF attachments.

I'm ranting to the already jaded here, but this finickiness is what disillusions authors from taking things further. I dare say, that many give up at this stage, either shoving their manuscript in a drawer or turn to self-publishing an ebook.

An increasing number of agencies are going over to an online form as a means of submission, which is more efficient and standardised in format. I prefer it, to mucking about with an email submission, laden with attachments.

Nevertheless, I was startled to see that Coombs Moylett Maclean insist on an attached jpeg image of the writer on their submission form.

About Coombs Moylett Maclean

This is a new one on me, though I dragged out an eight-year-old image of me looking like the Green Man. I've started to have suspicions that some literary agencies choose their clients by how attractive they are, as some client portfolios look like modelling agencies!

paulgreenman-paul1.jpg


They can't legally ask how old you are, though they try to get around that by asking for details of how long you've been writing.

I appreciate that a writer is as much a part of the 'brand' that their books represent and that their portrait will be used for marketing, but this development smacks of prejudice based on looks—of appearance over content.

What do you think?

About?
Of your theory-Yes, I agree. Looks do count.

Looks OVER content--I don´t think it goes THAT far, but they will like you more if you try harder.

Of the photo--you could do better. I´d say cut your hair very short, trim the beard, open the photo more so that it´s not so much a close up of you face. Zoom out a bit to get about half of your chest. And...maybe some fake glasses to make you look more writerly?
You´re a good looking guy, take advantage of that fact!
 
I've not had anyone want a photo, except where they were already publishing my story. I would pass over anyone who asked for one, assuming there was no good reason for them wanting one, and I wouldn't want to be represented by an agent who cared what I looked like.

The whole stereotyping thing is a minefield. No matter what, we all do it. What differs is how we react when our stereotypes are blown out of the water. Take @Emurelda , for instance. When I first met her here, she didn't use her photo on her profile. She mentioned she taught science. I assumed she was a man, which is totally stupid because I'm a female science teacher, too! And a woman who has faced plenty of sexism on the way there, herself. I still love the fact I was wrong, and that she's ten times more amazing than I thought she was when I assumed she was male, and I have endeavoured to stamp out that stereotype in myself since then.

I was once again brought up short the other day. Walking through a bookstore, I turned a corner and just about ran into a man who must have been well over 7 feet tall. I saw only his height. Then he smiled at me (or maybe he smiled at how short I am), and I mentally slapped myself--he was a person, not a height. It's so easy to focus on the differences, and not on the ways we are alike.

Ah, but this is beyond what you were asking, Paul. More to the point, I think I'd say you look more like Posiedon. And given what you've said about your writing, I think a moody, dark portrait is just fine. If the agent doesn't like it, you don't want them to represent you, anyway.
 
All of this talk about appearance reminds me of a quip attributed to the painter David Hockney, who, on clapping eyes on the aging poet W. H. Auden exclaimed:

‘If that’s his face, what must his scrotum look like?’


auden.png
 
This has gotten me thinking about my own photogenicity. ( Is that a word?)I am probably the least photogenic person you will ever know. My friends and family can vouch for it. Cameras really are not friendly with me. I will have to do something about it. We could also create an alter ego, like Daniel Handler´s Lemony Snicket. Which btw only served to add silliness to his writing.
 
This is the first time I've heard something like this. I will follow Boopadoo's excellent suggestion and send a picture of one of my dogs - this one for preference. That look kind of expresses everything I want to tell an agent, starting with pretty please...:)
 
Thinking about author photos...(and not being totally silly). I like the ones that aren't glamour shots. You know, the ones where the author is reading a book, or hanging out with their cat--the ones that tell you a little about the author.
View attachment 1456

It´s hard not to be push-over when you own a goat. There was a lady on my block who had a pet goat. She´s take him out to the park on a leash. It was the cutest thing ever seen. It was obvious that the goat had been a dog in her previous life and had come into this life with the personality of a Lab. Plus the crazy climbing.
 
It´s hard not to be push-over when you own a goat. There was a lady on my block who had a pet goat. She´s take him out to the park on a leash. It was the cutest thing ever seen. It was obvious that the goat had been a dog in her previous life and had come into this life with the personality of a Lab. Plus the crazy climbing.
One of the goats I used to have had been raised as a dog, and was given to me when her owners moved and didn't have room for her anymore. She loved riding in the car, and had no idea how to be a goat. It was a steep learning curve for her, coming to my herd and being beaten up by goats who knew what they were about. And when it came time to breed her...well, it was awkward. Poor puppy!
 
You know how sometimes your children let you down? choices of boyfriends, career, body piercings. etc... well our 23 year old landed us with he german spitz dog one year ago as she was travelling to america. now. she wants us to babysit her boyfriends pig. ' its ok. he thinks hes a dog'
 
You know how sometimes your children let you down? choices of boyfriends, career, body piercings. etc... well our 23 year old landed us with he german spitz dog one year ago as she was travelling to america. now. she wants us to babysit her boyfriends pig. ' its ok. he thinks hes a dog'
Don't do it! He may think he's a dog, but he still shits like a pig. :eek:
 
You know how sometimes your children let you down? choices of boyfriends, career, body piercings. etc... well our 23 year old landed us with he german spitz dog one year ago as she was travelling to america. now. she wants us to babysit her boyfriends pig. ' its ok. he thinks hes a dog'

Oh that sounds like fun! Let us know how that went.
 
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Querying across 'The Pond.'

Happy Thanksgiving to my US friends!

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